Ep 262 - NIL, Football Hype Train, Puppies

Questions from the Listeners

Who gets drafted higher (earlier) Devin Leary or Kenny Pickett?

Who has more draft picks over the next 4 years cheats or Pack

When Beck has a good season with Leary do you think he will jump or stay?

Who is the next former HC or coordinator to join Dave’s staff ( ie Joker and Ruffin)?

Now that Dave has been here for almost a decade, what is the identity of a Dave Doeren program now? What do you think he wants it to be?

What position group as a unit improves the most this year? We all want it to be OL but which one actually does?

Who replaces Vi? Very versatile player

Yea we've talked about all the hype, would love to know what a disappointing season would look like to y'all

Automated Transcription of this episode

00:21.40
redwhitepodcast
All right folks we are back with another edition of the red my podcast I'm your host Evan here with my man will well. It's been a while since we have spoken. How are you.

00:33.58
Will
I'm pretty good. Can't complain. How are you doing.

00:50.74
redwhitepodcast
Good Usually as the springtime spring bright is kind of ends and sports kind of tail off podcast kind of tails off. But in addition I've had some family things going on that have kept me quite occupied. And have also resulted in us having a new puppy hit the house so been pretty busy and just haven't been able to sit down and focus and and put out the quality content of this podcast usually is but.

01:47.88
Will
How's a is everything going on okay with the family. Okay, that's good. That's good.

02:05.42
redwhitepodcast
Better. It's ah it's a long process but better. Yeah yeah, and the puppy is actually really cool. She's really good but I don't know she's kind of a month I'll send you a picture later she four months old

02:10.48
Will
What what kind of puppy is it.

02:45.14
redwhitepodcast
She kind of looks like boxer but doesn't really have a boxer face. She kind of moves like a boxer not yet I don't I don't even know if I have an Instagram account but she's awesome. She's she's super sweet. Yeah.

02:37.82
Will
Does she have an Instagram account of. You can just start featureing her on the you can start feature on the podcast feed. It'll drive our numbers.

03:22.52
redwhitepodcast
I Probably I probably should yeah my boys like her and so we weren't planning on having her or now I think we're gonna keep her. That's how it started but she's really good. She's chill most the time. But.

03:21.54
Will
Are you just watching her temporarily. Okay.

03:59.17
redwhitepodcast
Typical boxer. She's kind of a spas so she'll just go crazy. So I think she's got some pretty sure she got some boxer in her. But how enough we'll see.

03:47.75
Will
Yeah, yeah, the zoomies just just trainer to retrieve golf balls you know and that's that's all you need.

04:20.98
redwhitepodcast
Oh I taught her to fetch so she's she's got that down were working out like little plastic balls like boun ball pitballs and she yeah, she's pretty good with those now I need a name though. Her name's Amy currently, that's what a.

04:39.36
Will
Now.

04:56.40
redwhitepodcast
She came with she kind of knows it. Kids aren't a huge fan I need a good name that kind of sounds similar to Amy cause she knows her name and ideally like wolf pack related cause that's what I do but I don't know if anybody's got a good female dog name that. Similar to Amy I'd love to have it.

05:24.26
Will
Car car. Emmy Yow

05:44.42
redwhitepodcast
So no, will not do that. She's sitting here staring at me at the moment but None of the things I wanted to talk about and we hadn't really you and I really had the chance to sit down and. Discuss what is going on with nsy state and n I and we'll just got up and walked away so okays good good quality podcast I got going here and I l self. Yeah, we're off the rest.

06:20.84
Will
No I'm here I'm here. Look. It's been a while we're off the rails early. Okay.

06:55.90
redwhitepodcast
The n ni podcast we did about pack of olds with Scott Wood and Josh Goodson and timmakay and Tom Lavo see the vol c yeah I mean they were they were good right? They're interesting what we're seeing around n ni is still. Still weird to me right? There's still a obviously a wild west but the incentive for people to and I talked to Tim Mckay about this two days ago because I had twezed something cam benman had tweed something and I said.

07:30.60
Will
Um, yeah.

08:12.25
redwhitepodcast
You know, kind of agreed with him and Tim Mckay Dms mean we start talking again about m and I l and he's you know, can you explain what you meant by this and what I meant was you know. What I had said was you know we're getting pulled in different directions from a fan standpoint camvin mentioned something about you know the money from the athletic department where's that money going and why are we yet burdening fans for yet another check.

09:04.78
Will
Yeah.

09:21.28
redwhitepodcast
Right? We have wolf pack club and like that day I had the wolf pack club the Alumni association and then like the messages that were put out for world pack of wolves like everybody trying to to get you get your money from me I to me that feels a little. I Don't know I don't want to say begging but but there's a lot of money flowing through the University food the athletic department and I know that they're technically supposed to be separate like the athletics and the collectives are separate So Let's pretend that we all know that that's aroused and it's not actually.

10:08.46
Will
Yeah.

10:38.64
redwhitepodcast
How it's working everywhere else. There's a lot of money flowing through here and yet they keep asking fans for yet another check and I think at some point and I think it's you know's particular with state fans and I told us to Tim that we need roi and he said you know what do you mean by that. And we got win and I you know and I told them like hey I don't this so mains for the football team because it's the best we've had in a long time but we still have one championship in 40 years and you're still out there reaching out to fans saying hey give us we need to be competitive. give us our money give us your money. And to me this starts to it starts to rub me the wrong way. What am I giving you money for right? What is the where is this money going. How is it being used and I get. There's like certain things we can and cannot talk about and how they're using it. And don't necessarily agree with that but a broader point is people don't know right? people. There's no transparency to any of the wolf pack club any of the pack of wolves and anybody athletic department.

12:28.38
Will
Yeah.

13:05.62
redwhitepodcast
You know where is this where is the millions of dollars that they are generating going to and I get there's coaches salaries and there's you know, upgrades and whatever else, but there's still not a lot of transparency and they just keep saying give us your money to be competitive but at some point state fans in particular. They've heard that for a long time and you're gonna stop and say like all right now. What am I giving this money for and that's kind of the point that's kind of where I am with the n a l and the n a is not necessarily the problem but it's just sort of taking the blunt the brunt of my. Angst in this situation because they're the new ones asking for check you know, asking for money.

14:07.14
Will
Well, yeah, so I mean let's be real. The None reason that in ill collectives exists is because we're being forced to treat these students still as I guess they're still considered amateurs. But there's. Whole business of college sports is fraudulently set up so that the money doesn't go to the people that are doing the labor. It only goes to half of them. You know name half of them. You know a fraction of them which is the coaching staffs and the sports staffs around them. And instead all this money is going to departments that then go use it on furvolous expenses like updates and facilities and things like that that in reality like you don't really need it like I'm pretty sure our wait room is still functional and yet we're getting a new weight room. You know that that money comes from somewhere. Oh you gotta expand something in the stadium you gotta to build a practice facility. You gotta do this, you gotta do that right? if and it's because there's this rule that says you can't have pay for play which is like there's no other sport out there. Ah, generates money that they say well you can't pay the athletes to come play for you. So that's why it exists and my theory is you know at some point someone's going to get another lawsuit through. Some point the players are going to start collectively bargaining and then this whole nonsense will go away to some extent, you'll still have collectives out there trying to work in. You know, creating opportunities for athletes to network and you know advertise things like that. But you know it's right now. It's just a wild west and you can either participate in it to help in the short term or you can kind of sit on the sides and say I give to the wolfpack club or I give directly to the university oh I'm not comfortable with this. I think it's okay to have any position but my theory is you know I'll probably sign up either tonight or tomorrow and for the and nil collective because I'm just curious to see what the process is like and that's. But my hope is just that in the next five years it doesn't have to be this way anymore. It's a stupid system. It's really stupid you know and you've got there was an article I think it was in the field Phil observer. Um by David Thompson and he was interviewing Cory Durden and you know Corey Dern has

19:32.38
Will
Fiance and he has 2 kids and he's a you know nonprofessional college football player right? and you know the article is talking about here. You know hey I I got to take my son to daycare I got to have food stamps in order to provide for the family because this is my full time job. And you know you hope it ends in then a payday for him in the Nfl and all works out but you're kind of sitting here and he had this great quote and I didn't write down for this but he basically said um yeah n ni is great. But if you don't have a large social media presence you. Basically you're just another football player and there's none of football players out there and from the get go I was super. You know skeptical of n nil in general in its premise because there's only so many athletes out there that are actually going to. Push a product and actually move numbers and actually give a return for business to invest in them in reality a lot of these collectives are either trying to do I guess what ours is which is like giving these guys opportunities to interact with you know businesses and you know build connections which I think is great. You know and then they're finding ways to creatively get money to players to you know, keep them happy and keep them around and it's stupid that the sport has to do this but you know I think I'm gonna participate in the n nil collective just because I want to say look I gave you guys at least something and I hope it. Helps somehow keep a football player around you know, but yeah.

22:57.32
redwhitepodcast
So here's a quote you put it in the pod chats I just pulled it up the same one you put in there earlier. The struggle though is finding those endorsements that seem to be only available to the sports biggest stars or players with a large social media presence dirt maybe all ace. Maybe an all accc lineman but he struggle with to find opportunities and felt lost when it came to selling himself to it. Advertisers I would go out and look for stuff but I realized that unless you are yes you really had a platform or a huge following. No one really cared that you played football. He said there are plenty of football players out there and that does not necessarily make you special. Was a very good I mean it's a good point but it brings me back to the collectives and the current state of them asking us for money to give to the players and the collective is stating give us money. Because it's going to help us be competitive and then you see the collective announced hey we're bringing on brion pass and that makes me wonder how does paying brion pass. Help us be competitive all right. It's think it's things like that like if we're being honest with ourselves the the n ni is inducing recruits. How can I get paid when I come to your school but we have to dance around that because it's technically air quotes not legal. Right? Technically frowned upon and you know you saw that everybody saw the whole Jimbo saving nonsense this past weekend. But so they're telling us None thing and then not and. I know they kind of have to this kind of where I'm I'm torn right? They they're telling us this thing that they have to tell us and they're saying your money's gonna go help us be competitive and we're giving it to the backup point guard. No offene brion pass I love him I think you'll be a good 4 year player but how does paying him. Make us more competitive I think that is the disconnect all this for me like I think what dirt is saying is right? You know they should be helping the players find these connections or there should be a way. For them to find these connections.

27:38.40
Will
So I mean I'll say this right brion pass says 12000 followers like you know it's not like he's a nobody there they could be seen this as but but that is that is I mean what it comes down to right is if they can set up a.

27:55.94
redwhitepodcast
Oh.

28:07.80
redwhitepodcast
But my best but that's not the point like what is what.

28:13.24
Will
Ah, meet and greet or whatever it takes and says grand pass you got 12000 followers tweet something out then that's an nil doing its thing in some capacity like I get it. It's like kind of confusing to see like ah you know you'd think well I know but it was just announced.

28:49.96
redwhitepodcast
But we haven't seen any of that stuff yet. We we've seen a but we've seen a bunch of guys come they've already said hey we've signed a bunch of players to the pack of olves and you can go look the list on the website have we seen any promotion.

28:49.46
Will
Right? So I mean.

29:02.18
Will
Right? Yeah, they got about 15 Yeah I mean that's the thing is right? You've signed them up. Maybe they're working on stuff I mean like ah you know it's fun like here's the thing right to your point.

29:29.90
redwhitepodcast
We hadn't seen promotion rotional from him.

29:38.16
Will
You'd think that this would be Devin Leary you think it would have been if you was still here. Manny Bates you know, but I mean look you got isaiah more drake thomas they are Thomas Peyton Wilson Sam high Phil like they're not just rank. They're not just backups.

30:03.92
redwhitepodcast
Um.

30:23.12
redwhitepodcast
Right? But they with the what but they're here like what.

30:13.82
Will
And so my guess is well right? But here's the thing if they're if part of their mission is legitimately opening doors for these people so that they have opportunities going forward outside of of college with the hope that they will be successful and then get back and in kind of self. You know promote this into something else in the future like they're gonna have to open their doors to more people than just players now like I get it. You say like why am I giving to this. Don't give like it. It.

31:28.62
redwhitepodcast
What about the point is I want them to I want the messages to be refunded I don't like the current state of things like I don't like the wolf Packck Club was like where's the incentive for me to give there other than tickets right? We've talked about this before I think it's There's a there's a discount we're I getting into the competitive.

31:29.48
Will
Well.

31:41.74
Will
Right.

32:06.44
redwhitepodcast
Niss of the 2 collectives yet. But I that's the problem to me is like their messaging is hey help us be competitive. How is giving that to the current players being competitive when.

31:57.00
Will
Yeah I think it's like this right.

32:12.10
Will
Right? yeah.

32:22.76
Will
Well because look right? The rule The rule is look. You can't You're not supposed to have it right? And my guess is a lot of these schools with collectives are not going to be the brash insane ones out there.

32:39.32
redwhitepodcast
The reality is you need to figure out how you pay no rogers.

33:01.74
Will
They're not going to be you know Inc States's never gonna be giving someone million dollars before they get here 100000 before they get here I just can't see it happening the way we can see that happening is we have a massive season all sudden. Our players are getting all this money and then they feel like it's not going to cause problems in the locker room to promise those opportunities. And so like it's just gonna be like that in the sport for a little while where you're go have people that are brazen about it text saying them for example and then you're gonna have people like state and others. They're probably trying to be a little careful now I will say it took a while for the nnil to get launched. They were kind of watching other and nils. I don't I mean there's these collectives are all over the place. So I'm not surprised that the messaging is a little vague right now and light on the details because quite frankly like these collectors are kind of operating hoping that they're not going to get screwed down the road. Is my guess so they're trying to be careful about it. You know, but it's like the same thing with wolfpack club like I mean the wolfpack club's thing was give us money so that we can pay for scholarships and you're like that's weird. You got like a multimillion dollar product that comes in every year I just saw that the Acc had the biggest year it's ever had. In revenue back in 2020 during covid each school got what $35000000? Whatever the number is like there's money there to pay for these athlete scholarships already. This is stupid to say that so to say otherwise right? but you have to have an n nio collective so that when Dave's out there recruiting or Keats is out there recruiting or a even's out there recruiting.

36:03.96
redwhitepodcast
Um, yeah.

36:14.58
Will
They say look we have a collective and then guys are getting paid and I'm not gonna tell you how much they're getting paid because I don't want to cross any boundaries. But when you get here, there's gonna be an opportunity you know and like I'd like to see you know I'd like to see Tommy tanks or whatever on here I'd like to see Devin on here like I'd like to see some studs. In here because I think it helps kind of explain what you're doing if you've got more? Oh no, there won't ever be like that was one of things we said going into it.

37:12.42
redwhitepodcast
I Yeah I get all that I'm saying that there's no transparency to it though and so and that's the and that's the problem though like what benefit is the collective if if Keys can't go out and say to the next point guard look even the backup point guard is getting.

37:39.38
Will
Yeah.

37:51.62
redwhitepodcast
X amount a month ah he can make up a number but there's no, it's not out there so you know are they just gonna go out go around slinging things on the recruiting trail just to say you know I that you're gonna lose you're gonna lose that way like ah.

37:57.78
Will
I think they're being careful like when who was the player for Miami well, you're gonna lose anyways because you're NCState like let's be real like you're only there is a ceiling for a program like this until you.

38:28.60
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, so so.

38:33.76
Will
Fully commit and go all in and state you know state as a program is like relatively in and that's why they're kind of like a top 35 program. You know in general in football basketball like tbd right? but you know there there is going to be a ceiling until. You get someone I I love Dave Dorn and I love the output. We're getting from him but I would not be remiss in saying like I'm a little disappointed in the recruiting cycle so far like I was expecting better and you know when you're going up against the big dogs like you gotta play like you're with the big dogs. So.

39:59.72
redwhitepodcast
Right.

39:52.58
Will
You might need to adjust your stuff a little bit and if NIL is that and we have to give money so that eventually someone coming by and saying who was the o line guy for that went to lsu that was from f I you or whatever right? that guy wanted money and we didn't have it set up and so.

40:31.62
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

40:31.40
Will
You know I'm guessing the coaches in general said we need to get something set up I don't care what it looks like I don't care what the numbers are. We've gotta get something set up and I feel like that's what we got right here and right now they're kind of filling it in I almost feel like they're filling it in in a way that makes it look like it's like look see. We're not just giving this to. The top dog in every single sport we're spreading it out among these guys I don't know or maybe a devon leary says I don't need to go through the NIL collective my agent's doing just fine, hooking me up with um, whatever that construction company is right like. So.

41:50.60
redwhitepodcast
We'll see that should be exactly this should that should be part of it like the dus quote where he says you know I tried to find you know opportunities. How did he try to find opportunities. You know how many how many times have I said this on the podcast even in the interviews with these guys.

41:49.88
Will
None yeah.

42:23.98
redwhitepodcast
Like hey I run small businesses right? I know a lot of people that run small businesses I would work out something with some of these guys that are interested in. You know what I'm doing or interested in promoting it. Nobody's just nobody's reached out about hey you know what can you do for dirt or you know what.

42:12.18
Will
Yeah.

43:02.24
redwhitepodcast
Ah, have XYZ interested in. You know, doing stuff on the web. Okay, well you know I can help all right. We can figure something out and.

43:04.30
Will
Wolf Pat what did I say yesterday you know and I l nannies you know for players that have kids right like I'd actually you know what if I I might like sent to them be like I'd like to give money and I'd like it to be earmarked to the players that have kids and they're struggling like is my.

43:27.34
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

43:50.40
redwhitepodcast
Right.

43:43.72
Will
None a year doing anything. Not really, but it it might help slightly for the week you know when they need it.

44:04.64
redwhitepodcast
I would love I would love that right? Yeah I would love that is at least a little bit more transparent and like hey look I'll give this money to to dirt I know he's got a lot He's doing this and maybe this goes to help you know for the kids and whatnot and. Yeah there's there's things that and like they said the collective like they're going to sign gear and whatever cool, right? That's fine but dirt we should be There should be a platform for these players to connect with. Wolf pack businesses that want to help them or want to use them to do what they're trying to do and I think I guess that's what the collectives is doing but I think if you're trying to control all that you're going to limit the scope here and I think that is. It's it's a problem like ah I think it's a problem I'd much rather donate to the collective than to the wolf pack club where the it I think there's no incentive for me to do that right? paying for a kid scholarship I can be less motivated to do that and. Reason is the university had damn $2000000000 endowment. Why are we still you know playing this game right? We're still pretending that you student athletes and it's it's to me. It's annoying and it's I don't even know where my frustration is with all this I'm just kind of frustrated with all of it.

46:32.58
Will
Yeah.

46:59.78
Will
Yeah.

47:15.42
redwhitepodcast
And I know a lot of people are too. There's a lot of like people in the chat who's like hey you know I'll probably give the collective but I don't know yet, you know, Um, what am I doing What is it where is it money going. How is this really helping us win to me. That's that's just kind of where I am with it like I don't like it and. Not that I don't like players getting paid I don't like how but we're just pretending that things aren't happening I think that's stupid.

47:51.20
Will
Yeah, but that's I mean that's just the way this sport has been for the longest time and like you and I are the same thing like why can't a school that has a $2000000000 endowment use some of that money to help I mean there's they're student athletes aren't they they are students. Why can't that money come from this the university it's it's really so it's the thing that really frustrates me that most about this sport in general is everything is quote unquote you know that's the tradition. That's how things were and it's like okay like.

48:42.36
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

49:01.34
Will
Feel like I'm I'm old enough at this point in my life to see someone saying Well, that's just the way things are and then I can see them collecting all the money in the background like but this is just how it was. It's how it's always been and it's like f you man like I'm tired of the bulls like the bulls are literally just.

49:25.64
redwhitepodcast
Um, yes, yeah yeah.

49:50.48
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

49:38.48
Will
Taking money to quote host a game that any other school in fbs football could easily host. You could go do all these games at Fcs schools. You really want to be like charitable and like bring you know change things in the sport go host this on an Fcs team help those guys out.

50:20.12
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, bold bold directors getting million dollar a year salaries like that thing just blows my mind but that's part of it. So that's part of it with athletics right? We're pretending athletics doesn't make a.

50:14.20
Will
You know like there's.

50:23.20
Will
Yeah, doing doing what you know they're they're party planners.

50:58.20
redwhitepodcast
Ton of money to the point where Kevin Keats just gets an automatic extension and boo gets an automatic extension. You're like why for what like they if Keats was smart. He'd say to the collective I'll give you a million dollars for your collective. Get me some damn players if I'm a coach that's what I'm doing because what is that none to him probably not a lot give it to the collectives get me players do what you need to do to get me players.

51:46.36
Will
Yeah, you know what will help a doran or a Keats or whomever like stay in business a lot longer I mean like I I cannot understand this fuckingking industry. Oh well, what happens if we pay the players well then the the oh the expenses. How are we gonna afford it I don't know like you can stop paying head coaches. And their staffs None and millions of dollars you can cut it slightly 10% 20 % whatever it is and you could basically fund of almost all the teams at that point you know I mean I'm just like taking a quick this is I don't even know what even year this is but it's referencing.

52:44.36
redwhitepodcast
Um, yeah. Right? yeah.

53:01.20
Will
North Carolina State Sports information says they took in total revenue of $92000000 and they had expenses of 91000000. They have 21 head coaches I don't you know I got to read through this but like here's the thing does it really cost $91000000 to run this thing if you were actually running it like it was a business and you're like man I got to be a little bit careful here. Like we can't be so frivolous with Xy and z you know it just ah like treat us like adults I'm so tired. Oh like you know here's the thing. Let's say you make students athletes employees. Okay so they're part of the university. Whatever. I don't understand any of these arguments. Why everyone says? Well, you can't have them like you can't give them a scholarship like why can't make going so to school still be part of the equation. It's part of the benefit package. All we're saying is that the benefit package should also include a semi-annual or annual salary or quarterly salary. Want to do it. Oh what? if they transfer well then they only get paid for that much money while they were there like it is what it is like there's no there's no reason you have to say well we can't let that they can't be athletes anymore and be students now. It could be both like people work jobs and then they go to night school and do grad school on the weekends like. It's still feasible. You know there's there's ways you could approach this give them scholarships and say okay instead of being like you have to do a minimum of 1214. Whatever their current load is you could say like during the season you only need to do None or 2 classes max. And then during the offseason. That's when you guys can catch up and by the way these scholarships won't just be for your scholarships anymore. They're good until you graduate you know as long as you're maintaining progress to getting a degree like we could be so much smarter about this and instead it's ah. Don't touch the the prized money cow.

56:48.80
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, exactly and that's that's it to me like and the Yahoo guys and cover three they they do much better job of kind of talking about the whole landscape but they're all kind of saying the same thing like it's been an arms race with. Facilities right? That was always it. We need to have better facilities. We need to have this and that and then I heard somebody I think it was Dan Wetzel made the point look at the Nfl like those guys are practicing in pop up tents right? They're practicing in fields with absolutely nothing. You watch hard knocks in this There's no facilities there they have they they all all the money goes to the players to the stadiums right? They're not pretending you need to do this or that like they're pay the players and have a good stadium. That's it. That's that's what you need and we're dancing around it with all this. All this nonsense and that's kind of bringing it back to where what bendermin said that start this whole conversation this week he says hold up. Let's be clear athletics wants Wolf pack nation to pay $25 pay a $25 membership to quote stay competitive regarding and nil wtf is that gonna do. We've generated none already. Where's that fricking money wolffa nation does not and should not have to pay to achieve that and this was in part of he retweeted the brion pass Instagram post and ah and I can you know agree with him I think. Camps off his rocker sometimes and even in our conversations. A lot of people don't agree with what he says and I I don't think it's necessarily I think his message is right? Maybe the delivery is not the best. But I think what he's saying is. Very much how I feel is like I just feel like we're being and I I definitely feel like this with the university right? Universities are so bloated with administration costs and whatever that you know the tuition is astronomical and yet they still go around begging people for money like. Why are is why are these things run so poorly that we have to pretend that the fans should be subsidizing all of these efforts in addition to tickets parking. Concessions all this other stuff that we are generating for them to me. It's it's very disenuous and it feels very I don't know dirty.

01:01:36.28
Will
Yeah I mean we're we're here because the powers that be refuse reality and now it's I mean it's I think lane was talking about this link effin for an si report and I think we've been saying it's It's like okay. Boosters are gonna start giving more money and saying I basically bought you this player. Why isn't he starting and then the coach says he's not starting because he hasn't done what he needs to do to start? Whatever it is what it is. You know I'm the coach. You're the booster I know it's a frat relationship here but I gotta do my job.

01:02:31.94
redwhitepodcast
Yes, yes, so.

01:02:51.70
Will
Well, you're not gonna be doing your job anymore because if you don't play this guy. You know he's transferring and then I'm pulling my money out and then you're gonna get fired and you know what I say let it happen like it already happens anyways. But now it's more like out in the open and I got a feeling. Lot of these programs that are offering millions millions of dollars and but you know they want to say they're not buying a class but they sure are being very active in and nil and acquiring talent rate I can't wait to see it blow up because here's the thing every year. There's only a few teams and they're usually the same teams.

01:03:50.86
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

01:04:04.20
Will
There's only a few teams that can even get 1112 wins a year and get championships. There's a reason the bell curve operates as it operates almost consistently every year in football and maybe less so on basketball cause you can have more impact on a basketball team with 1 player but football is football.

01:04:53.00
redwhitepodcast
All right.

01:04:43.66
Will
And in general, there's usually None or 2 top dogs. There's like 10 in the none tier and then everyone else is basically you know within a standard deviation of each other The results aren't gonna change. There might be a little bit of slip up at the top. But honestly like it's gonna be the same thing. It's always been. Texas a and m guarantee they don't win a national title despite what they're doing because it's just it's tough no in like the next like two or three years so I'm saying like with these classes like I just it's just hard because of where they are in their conference like it's just hard to imagine that everything's got to go right.

01:05:44.28
redwhitepodcast
When ever.

01:05:56.16
redwhitepodcast
And.

01:06:02.34
Will
And there's a lot of other teams down there that are buying players you know and then people are getting get pissed off and then bla bla but you know and eventually a recruits are gonna not get the deal. He wants and is gonna go on the record and be like these guys told me this beforehand and told me not to do this bla Bla Bla Blah blah and then boom it's gonna blow up so I can understand.

01:06:15.64
redwhitepodcast
It's.

01:06:35.84
Will
Why certain collectives are maybe being a little cautious but the whole thing is this doesn't need to be the way it is you could just pay these guys a salary. Let the let n I l be more legitimate and be these opportunities that these guys actually make money off their name image and like this I think they should be doing stuff like we've been. Promoting where it's do events do experiences let us interact with these guys have Devin Leary and Peton Wilson and his Isaiah Moore like coach a little None on None flight football team for kids like just let your parents sign the book. Let the parents sign up for the league. They do it in the offeason boom. Couple grand right? there like it's not that hard to do this in a legitimate way and I think once you start paying these guys. It will come to it.

01:08:07.53
redwhitepodcast
Help help us I'm cutting you off here help the players build something rather than just begging us for money to give to the players. That's what I'm saying like I I think the collective is probably the is way more important than.

01:08:16.68
Will
Yeah, yeah.

01:08:45.28
redwhitepodcast
The wolfbe club and probably the athletic department. If for being honest, but don't just beg me for money help the players do something show me what you are building to help Cory Durden feed his kids like I'd be all for that right? I'd be all forgiving. Somebody an opportunity to you know make a connection with me or my business or other businesses that I know I just we don't see any we don't there is none of that there isn't on that right now it's just give me more money and coming back to camp's point like I think he's right? and.

01:09:32.38
Will
Yeah.

01:09:57.86
redwhitepodcast
People don't agree with him because he's very outspoken sometimes about different things. But I think right here he's spot on and it's funny that you and I have had this conversation before and I just saw it on entire pack sports James have posted thing collectives collectives verse booster clubs and and. Basically who's gonna be are we we have another None right? Who's gonna be more important and how are they going to. They're gonna buttheads like it's coming. They're going to clash like you said they're going to clash over you playing time or who where the money goes. Don't like this coach so I'm not Goingnna get let the our collective give you know money to a guy he wants. It's it's coming and we're pretending like it's not gonna happen I think to me that's shortsighted that and that's a completely different.

01:11:15.16
Will
Um, yeah.

01:11:48.44
redwhitepodcast
Point then all of other stuff I just wanted to point out because it is becoming a topic that more people are you know, being aware of but is something that we've certainly mentioned before there's is a conflict coming at some point can you imagine if the athletic department after next year it's like you know we want to keep Keats and the booster club. You know some of the boosters are like yeah we like them too and the collectives like now not my thing you know we need. We need some new blood in here. How are you gonna resolve that it's gonna happen. It's gonna there's gonna be some really tough conversations that are happening.

01:12:43.46
Will
Well whoever pays Kevin Keats salary gets to make that decision like that's what it is in reality the funding for why? No right? But what you'll see is right? This is how it always happens right? They'll say I'm not giving my money to x anymore I want it to go to here.

01:13:07.84
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, but that's not how it's going to happen because.

01:13:18.96
Will
Until you guys I'm gonna go invest in El a da because at least he's doing something you know that that kind of talk and that's fine. Let the market move itself how it wants but like I just think I don't know I can't stop thinking about like you know got I have this thing called like the wolf pack Cub club where we.

01:13:37.34
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

01:13:58.42
Will
You know, put money towards getting these guys nannies or whatever like it's kind of we We really should have been the one to start these and ills. Um.

01:14:16.52
redwhitepodcast
Okay. It. It's it's tough to me to watch all this stuff go down and just pretend like it's ah it's you know it's all good and this is just how it's gonna be like just I don't know man just doesn't feel right? How this is how this is. Currently playing out and I hope it doesn't last long.

01:14:55.72
Will
Yeah, ah you know at some point it's just like the money I mean fans are already frustrated with having to pay so much at game day and you know things like that and just the effort to be a fan at some point makes you go. You know what man like I'm not interested in this.

01:15:42.52
redwhitepodcast
Um, yes, exactly exactly I feel like that a lot with and I have ltrs and I'm like man don't really want to do this like I just watched on Tv that's kind of the point where like I am teetering on this and I've had this conversation and I know there's loyal.

01:15:34.96
Will
And you know.

01:16:19.40
redwhitepodcast
Pac fans have had the same conversation. You feel like you're you know pot committed and bit of the sunk cost fallacy in play here. But I mean I mean that's exactly you you summed it up that's kind of where I am at this point I think a lot of people are feeling that same thing you keep asking me for money. And some point. Well, we're just gonna turn it all off stop it all not giving anybody any my mornings here watch on Tv and then you people are gonna say well you know you're a bad fan. You didn't you didn't donate your money now. I'm a smart person who wants some ah roi and I want to know where my money is going. So.

01:17:14.10
Will
Yeah, that's why that's why I'm more of a fan of the wolfpack investment club idea you know.

01:17:42.76
redwhitepodcast
It's great I Think it's a great idea I think I I I think I sent that to scoutwood I'm pretty sure I did send I sent to one of them. They're like it's a really good idea. Yeah, it is a good idea so old pack Social security. Yeah.

01:17:40.24
Will
Yeah I Hope so I mean like honestly like I just I Probably don't have the time to set it up. Yeah, just basically yeah, it should be you know, Just let's just donate. Let's just make this large ass fund. It'll pay out Now. It's probably gonna be pennies on the dollar but it'll pay out and you know I and Then. We all share in the benefit you can hold your little piece and you can say I'll set the returns to go give to the club. You know I think it's I think there's better thing I think there's smarter ways to use fans money to help out athletes than simply just just put dollars in their pocket right now I think it's really effed up that we have to keep doing this. But.

01:18:31.94
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

01:19:01.82
redwhitepodcast
Agreed.

01:18:59.14
Will
Whatever I'm sure if you've been mowing your grass and listening to us to this point I think we have exhausted this part of the topic.

01:19:20.54
redwhitepodcast
Yes, we have and I think dovetailing into this this football season right? This is one of the things that we we got a lot of questions on football and um I'm trying to figure out how to organize them but essentially. We have been getting a lot of hype. We've had preseason you know top rankings from number None to number None from all the way to early preseason polls you have guys like big game boomer who's been standing for Nc state and just they're gonna be good and here's why and even people who are notorious state doubters state haters Stuart Mandell had us in the top None and number 7 I think. Pete Thmel had us in his top None you're like yo this is crazy with these people are finally starting to you give us some recognition. How do you feel about all of that right now.

01:21:30.46
Will
Um, it's great to be on the preseason hype train I love it. Um I'm still concerned about some holes on the ross aren just things we've seen over the years so there's a part of me that's like the program should be doing everything they can to capitalize on this.

01:22:03.40
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

01:22:04.54
Will
And they should be telling recruits look how good we are. You could be the next piece you're gonna be the one that gets us from top None to top 5 ya yeah, yeah, do whatever you gotta to do sell sell sell right now you should be marketing the hell out of this. You know one of the podcasts they was like talking about how the Acc has all of these quarterbacks and how the Acc is a conference yet is not. Like promoting this like crazy man like this is qbc or whatever you want to call it like take all the hype you can right now before the data possibly screws it up. You know as soon as you sell someone on this stuff and they're like oh man, you guys.

01:23:02.30
redwhitepodcast
Right.

01:23:18.10
Will
Lost a couple games early in the season. It's like oh yeah, but this happened if you were here but that wouldn't have happened but blah blah blah right? I am shocked that we are not like going just Hog wild on social media with this stuff and being like we're so you know that you could be like.

01:23:54.60
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

01:23:50.68
Will
And what you could do is you be like show picture to the guys like with their heads down doing their work as usual and then you know just all around them right top 10 but bla bla just and just show the guys. You're still like going along their business right? like I think you can embrace it.

01:24:28.14
redwhitepodcast
Sounds like a job for our intern if he's listening here's a here's a question that are around this that somebody asked in the chat today. We've talked about all the hype would love to know what a disappointing season would look like for you guys.

01:24:26.52
Will
That's right.

01:25:05.36
redwhitepodcast
So what would be a good season and what would be a disappointing season.

01:24:59.10
Will
I wish we could pull our audio from last year we should do that going into the preseason at least cause I think I said I always couch. It is if Devin leery is healthy and if the defense is healthy then man ah let me let me pull up our schedule real fast. None off let's see what our me look at see what our over under is on this thing first in Cstateeight and a half. Yeah I mean I would bet the over on that I look. Let's let me just go the schedule real fast. So.

01:25:57.36
redwhitepodcast
It was None I believe

01:26:12.52
Will
Probably the best out of conference schedule. We've had in some time to get to 4 wins in all honesty, right? you get through that you know super bowl on opening day with ecu. Um, let's just.

01:26:47.58
redwhitepodcast
Which by the way is a noon game if you haven't heard which is about the perfect as can be. You don't want those drunkards getting drunken rowdy down there. Yeah so noon game is perfect.

01:26:50.76
Will
Man you don't want it to be a night game I'll tell you that um so I mean I'll just read their schedule when Charleston southern win texas tech I think we should win Connecticut we should win Clemson at Clemson I think we're gonna lose to be honest, um. Fsu based on what we've seen in the recent years win. But I think that's gonna be a lot more competitive than it has in the past Syracuse is a dumpster fire when Virginia tech is a dumpster fire. Currently, they have like no wide receivers. They're a complete mess on the lines so that should be a win wake toss up. Bc at home I think we should beat them. But maybe it toss up Louis Volp I think we should beat them you and see we should definitely beat them so I I'm already at None loss and 2 tossups. So at a minimum I'm thinking we should be None and None and I'll be disappointed if it's None three I think we should be None and 2.

01:28:50.28
redwhitepodcast
Right.

01:28:48.52
Will
If we're healthy like if the defense I mean here's the thing. The defense cannot have another season where it's decimated by injuries and that's we've had that 2 years in a row now 3 if you count the 2019

01:29:18.38
redwhitepodcast
I will say while I while I agree if we have a year that we're gonna sustain injuries. We've got some depth you know at most positions this year that I feel better about it's not like. Ah.

01:29:33.24
Will
Yeah.

01:29:57.80
redwhitepodcast
Ah, you know I don't remember what year it was when we got a bunch of guys hurt and we're playing a lot of freshmen right? It was at 2019 yeah so I feel a lot lot better about that I think the quarterback position obviously they brought in Jack Chambers for that reason to bolshster that depth you know.

01:29:50.74
Will
2019 yeah Yeah

01:30:15.68
Will
Part of the and Nil team.

01:30:36.38
redwhitepodcast
That's right, He's also in the pack of wolves after yeah, not gonna bring that backwards.

01:30:27.56
Will
Now I could see that one coming because I was positive if you get someone and they're technically still a walk on I guarantee you there's some opportunities are being found to close the the gap on his you know his scholarship and things like that.

01:31:06.28
redwhitepodcast
Right? right? right? Um, yeah.

01:31:02.70
Will
So what do you think? do you think night is 90 Three bad, not bad right? but expectation wise.

01:31:26.40
redwhitepodcast
I would be disappointed if everything that we've everything that Dave has done to this point. It's all mount amounted to None and None again like. Understand how historically we're not a very good program so to be disappointed None in 3 in the grand scheme seems kind of silly. But if we're None and 3 I'd be disappointed because this is a year where you have everything lined up. You have Dave out there beating the drone that he's got the best quarterback in the country right? You've got. Everything falling in place you know zavola comes back or zavo gets another year. All the things that seem to be working for you in your favor now. All right Ant Smith it's gonna shine. So there's a lot of the.

01:32:27.46
Will
Methods.

01:32:44.38
Will
Anthony Smith looks great in the spring game.

01:33:14.64
redwhitepodcast
A lot of that kind of comes into play like the Clemson game I feel good about that game. But again it's at Clemson and you kind of expect us to lose that game and I think that is perfectly fine to to say that because it's at Clemson's tough game I get it. But I think.

01:33:34.92
Will
Just just don't get steamrolled right.

01:33:53.98
redwhitepodcast
Right? I think we're the better I think we the better allround team in that regards and it's ironic that the acnetwork is even now beating our drum Jordan Cornet was on. Um I guess his show with Eric Mclane today and they were talking about how. You know, Clem's can have a cobe cubi controversy and that makes nc state the best team in The Atlantic and the Acc and and I agree so I would think None and 3 would be disappointed. Not three would be disappointed to me. The backs were losing to I would assume Clemson and then you're losing to None ah None other teams that. Honestly, there's nobody on this schedule that you should lose to like wake is gonna be wake and so but I don't know where that other loss would come if we happen to wake forest a game.

01:35:00.32
Will
So the the None thing that yeah. Well here's my concern right? You get fsu literally the week after Clemson, there's a historic thing where you play Clemson you almost always lose the next game and then after we beat Clemson last year we looked like crap against Louisiana tech.

01:35:46.32
redwhitepodcast
Right.

01:35:47.36
Will
So I could that's that's the 1 game in there I'm like oh man if we win at Clemson you know can we get up twice in a row like that to get fsu because I think fsu is gonna be better this year um let me you like put it like this. Well yeah, yeah, let me let me phrase it to you like this because I did the research.

01:36:18.20
redwhitepodcast
They will be they get wake before us.

01:36:25.78
Will
Um, where do you think inc state stands in the last five years in conference records inside the Acc.

01:36:54.46
redwhitepodcast
Ah, conference records. They've got to be top 20194 pride brings that down. Yeah, that's good. Oh I would have said top 2 But yeah, 2019 probably brings that down a little bit but other than that I would you I would have said top.

01:36:56.38
Will
They are number 2 number 2 in the last five years

01:37:17.70
Will
It's that's I mean that's with None right this is you got Clemson then at 61 games state has 39 Wins Miami 38 wake 38 pit 37 for Jane check 34 and it goes on u and c is at 26 they're not doing good.

01:37:31.50
redwhitepodcast
top 3 top 4 yeah

01:37:51.84
Will
And then if you look at like for the last eight years which we'll call like the modern acc error I think that's when Louisville came in insy states number None or actually number 2 they're tied with Miami at 61 wins like state's been pretty damn good for quite some time even with those blip years. So. It kind of makes sense to look at that schedule right? and say is there anyone really that should be threatening us, especially this is the year that's always favorable for us where you have wake and bc at home and really Clemson's really your only tough road game right? So I guess I'm just so surprised. It's none.

01:38:59.66
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:39:06.42
Will
You know for the over under that just doesn't seem right to me. But.

01:39:23.90
redwhitepodcast
Well they think they always undersell us right? None last year was free money this year's still probably free money but it's it's borderline. It's it's closer I would be if we were None and 4 I would be very disappointed and None and 3 I'd I'd be disappointed and I I know that's weird to say given historical results. But. Everything that you have no excuses this year on top of having the almost perfect schedule. You have the team that you've wanted to have for a long time question marks at running back position I think you know is a long and to be able to hold up those are probably the None only real questions.

01:40:30.18
Will
Yeah.

01:41:04.54
redwhitepodcast
And you know again all my my concern with everything football related is not necessarily the players I think we've got enough talent and depth and almost all positions is how are we going to act right? How are. How are they gonna coach are they going to be aggressive and keep come back to wake forest and their funky offense right? But they it's helped them create and create an advantage and. Don't know that we are dynamic enough or we haven't been dynamic enough in the past to feel confident in a lot of those games like to feel overly confident like I feel like we should win them because we're just better than most of those teams better coach better players better depth older. But are you going to play conservative. Are you going to? you know how are you? How aggressive are you going to be are you going to just you know throttle people and we've yet to see that from Dave and his staffs. I don't know if it's Dave or his staff right? I don't know where you know what? the ah aggressive tendencies where those lie but that's still my only concern is is how are we going to handle that.

01:43:27.28
Will
Yeah, well here's my theory I mean I guess I haven't dug through it but I kind of remember like ten years ago right when he had his niu teams that were primed for championships. He was aggressive and.

01:44:07.40
redwhitepodcast
Love.

01:44:03.32
Will
If you go back and look at I don't know who did that long devon leary article recently. Maybe that was the athletic but maybe not um and in there they were talking about how basically they thought he was going to start be ready to kind of take the reins in 20 20 right? and then gets hit with contact tracing then they didn't want. They said they didn't want to bring him along because they didn't want to. They weren't sure if he was ready yet because Hockman had been practicing for like None straight weeks or whatever right? and then they give him the rains he immediately shows he's capable then it gets injured and they're like well is it a fluke I don't know. And so I feel like they kind of started last season off too slow because they were like I don't know if it's if he's a real deal or not right. They didn't trust him they didn't believe in him right? and then you see the u and c game right? And what's you know Beck asked Doran like you know what do you want to be doing. He's like let let Larry sling it like he's.

01:45:44.38
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

01:45:56.12
Will
This is him let him do it and Dave says in a couple times that article like he's special. He's he brings something that he didn't have with brisset and with Finley in that he's won those last minute drives that those guys never did. He's just got something clutch and I when I was reading it I said that sounds like a guy who says.

01:46:31.60
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

01:46:35.76
Will
This is my year I need to go f and win and Larry is smart enough that he is not gonna make a lot of dumb interceptions for us. So I'm gonna go sling it all over the yard and try to win I hope they do that because I don't want to see a year where it's like. Right? We got up None or 3 scores relatively early. Let's just pack it in and let the defense do its thing like now I hope some of these coaches watch like Georgia Annihilate Teams Alabama Annihilate teams right? Lsu like when you're good and when you've got when you've got the goods at quarterback in particular, you should let them do their thing. Um, and yeah.

01:48:02.58
redwhitepodcast
It's a perception thing too like if you're trying to and again those sounds crazy but you're trying to make the playoff you better, be wowing people. You better, be putting up points and you better be doing dramatic things that. Are going to get people's attention because you've got the attention now when you have the attention of Stuart Randell and Pete Thmel to notorious woolpack haters like capitalize on that capitalize on that exposure and you've got. Yeah, you've got to come out and just put your foot down the whole time. That's still my only concern.

01:49:10.42
Will
Yeah, you know what was great is in that article Dave was like I don't get it. It happened with Peyton Wilson and happened with Devin Leary some for some reason when these guys are having massive years. They don't get the recognition that year they get the recognition the following year and I was like it's because of how you've played.

01:49:49.64
redwhitepodcast
Great. Um, yeah.

01:49:47.96
Will
You've you've been relatively boring and frankly like you haven't you know until last year right he didn't have that huge marquee win right? and you know so you've got their attention now because you finally did it and you trusted him to go out and win those games. So. My thinking is maybe he's kind of seeing the light on that a little bit but I don't know this is always at risk with like defensive coordinator head coaches like they're gonna trend tend to their where their comfort zone is which is grounded pound and. Hope you can burn the clock.

01:51:10.10
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, so I'm going to go on record and say None and 3 I'd be disappointed and no others have is a a really good debate in the chat today about that about this topic and I didn't really say too much but I I'm gonna say None and 3 would be disappointing to me 10 and 2 is is what you should be at least None and two I think I just I think you're too good right? Yeah yeah, so I'll never run through these questions that there's I don't know none questions here.

01:51:42.22
Will
Look this could be the last year to win the Dam Atlantic division it may not you better? do this right.

01:52:28.28
redwhitepodcast
Who gets drafted hire earlier Devin Lear or can it pick Kenny pick it. This is a kind of older question but still relevant. No idea.

01:52:28.72
Will
Wait when did where did Kenny get drafted None hold on I should have looked this up. Sorry.

01:52:59.46
redwhitepodcast
I'll look it up. None Overall.

01:53:04.52
Will
Canny Pickett got Wheels Devin doesn't so I can see Devin have just a monster year and then like someone's gonna be like i' a statue and give him None round grade and he's not as tall as picket either. But he doesn't wear gloves.

01:53:46.58
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, bigger hands than have small hands.

01:53:35.68
Will
Man this is tough. I think a team would be really great to draft him but usually the teams that are smart enough to get a quarterback like him are the better teams. So there'll be later in the draft order. So I don't think he will draft higher than can he pick it but I could see him earn a like a. Late none high None grade.

01:54:37.40
redwhitepodcast
So fun fact. Kenny Pickett had 1 more rushing yard than Devin Leary did last year yep to 84 2 3

01:54:38.84
Will
That cannot be possible. That guy fake slid somebody and I know that Devin can't do that so on that alone he is more athletic.

01:55:15.90
redwhitepodcast
That fake slide is such nonsense too because he was not doing that on purpose he was trying to slide and change his mind. He could not do that in purpose if he wanted to yeah complete accident.

01:55:16.30
Will
Oh definitely. That's one of those things where the body there this is kind of like with golf right? where you're like trying to force something into your swing. There is no way you can make that motion as smooth as he did with that fake slide.

01:55:49.40
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, yeah, intentionally yeah.

01:55:48.82
Will
And it works out like that's only your brain just goes course correct and you know good for him. Fuck wake. Yeah.

01:56:18.94
redwhitepodcast
It's our mom who has more draft picks over the next four years you and c or the pack.

01:56:16.10
Will
Over the next 4

01:56:33.10
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, yeah.

01:56:27.40
Will
I mean I'm gonna go in c state just because I we're gonna have a huge hall one of these I guess probably this year you would think but you know look you see stockpile's talent right now like it or not um.

01:56:53.12
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, Twenty Twenty Three drafts should be pretty good.

01:57:02.72
Will
There's some guys on their defensive line that I really like um and they've got you know they at least have a track record of getting skill players that are actually drafted sorry like I think we should point out like it's a little frustrating. Or maybe it's not maybe it explains exactly why Nc State hasn't quite broken through yet one of your best wide receivers ever is an underdirected free agent to your better running backs undrafted like we have got to get some pop on the skill positions. You know harmon None or none round to cope. Yeah.

01:58:13.52
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

01:58:13.84
Will
Um, yeah Jacoby was undrafted Jacoby Myers like it's it's kind of obvious why state has like struggled to break through like they they really need to fix their wide receive recruiting and paid Noah Rogers

01:58:51.74
redwhitepodcast
There we go when Beck has a good season with leary leary goes pro. Do you think Tim Beck will find another job or will he stay.

01:59:07.84
Will
Are his daughters still going to school at um, when someone ah like a volleyball player and when the schools around here. That's the first thing I mean he'll be. He'll be getting paid I mean here's the thing right? He's he's coached with the worst possible people in Urban meyre.

01:59:33.34
redwhitepodcast
Yeah I think so yeah, warming did maybe.

01:59:47.28
Will
And he's seen how he's treated at a Texas rate so at least here like no one's telling him what to do so I could see him stay especially if he likes what he's got in Mj or you know Lex I mean I really I'm really excited about Mj Morris personally and I can see him.

02:00:23.66
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, yeah.

02:00:26.14
Will
Like in what he's seeing there but that's a tough question man like I can't imagine this whole staff stays together again like they just did like Gibson will gets.

02:00:44.78
redwhitepodcast
But it is a tough question Tim Beck took a lot of heat at Ohio State Nebraska Texas right? He's all like all those places where they have essential a hostile fan bases.

02:01:05.14
Will
Yeah, but.

02:01:20.90
redwhitepodcast
Hords that kind of thing and like I oh he hasn't taken much heat here maybe from us a few times but I don't know that's an interesting question like does is he comfortable or would he look to I think he would be a candidate they if they have a really good year Aswara. This is where I'll go with this if we have a really good year Larryric gets drafted higher than Kenny Pickett my opinion he will get a g 5 job. He will get somebodyo pull him away to.

02:02:10.20
Will
Um, if I mean here's the thing. What here's the thing right? like if he has a baller ash year here. We're going to also give him quite the raise to and out.

02:02:30.54
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, and I know Smu just got a job ah got hired hired a guy but like somewhere like that.

02:02:45.26
Will
Why would you want to be a g 5 head coach at this point like with what you're seeing with n ni l I know it's an ego thing but there's nothing that he's been an office coordinator and nothing has said like I'm trying to get a head coaching job like nothing in his background really shows that he hasn't been a head coach since like high school.

02:03:05.20
redwhitepodcast
It's ego thing right.

02:03:31.16
redwhitepodcast
Well, he's had a. He's a a lot of tumultuous stops and he's finally like if we have ah the year that we expect everybody to have. He's had he'll have that he'll have his name there and I think a lot of people will recognize that that.

02:03:23.10
Will
Ninety Ninety nine

02:03:38.24
Will
Yeah.

02:04:08.56
redwhitepodcast
Maybe not g five maybe Arizona state right? I mean her edwards gonna lose his job soon i.

02:04:00.56
Will
Yeah I mean I think I think there's some coordinators that don't want to be head coaches like it's there's nothing I'm getting from him really that's giving me head coach 5 at least with Gibson you know he's been trying to get a head coaching gig so that makes more sense but like here's the thing right.

02:04:24.62
redwhitepodcast
Probably but I don't know if that's I don't know if that's him.

02:04:42.96
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

02:04:39.98
Will
Ah, house state was 11 and two with him and frankly like urban meyer has his hands all over everything in the None place. So I really doubt that Tim Beck had that much control there I'm just super doubtful Texas Texas was a Texas the offense wasn't the problem like I went back and looked at those numbers. It was the defense and guess what.

02:05:10.20
redwhitepodcast
Well, that's the point that's yeah same thing same thing Texas right.

02:05:19.42
Will
Tom Herman ain't there Tim Beck left and they still stunk you know and Texas still stinks anyways with sarcasian like so like I don't want to hear it I I think Tim Beck's like 1 of those ones like he's like the perfect o see date like you get to complain about and yet he's.

02:05:43.80
redwhitepodcast
Here.

02:05:58.42
Will
Putting up pretty decent numbers. Our points per game is pretty damn good right now and he's gotten the most out of freaking Bailey Hockman and whoever that Texas quarterback was the Nebraska quarterbacks and you know the biggest gripe is that Ohio state he didn't run eliot enough I cut. Okay.

02:06:15.52
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

02:06:29.88
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

02:06:46.68
redwhitepodcast
Can wait for postman to hear this one. Ah, who is the next this is tough question I don't really know how to answer who is the next former head coach or coordinator to join Dave staff like choker phillips or roughing meal. Um I don't know where to take that question. But.

02:06:36.44
Will
Okay.

02:07:00.34
Will
Um.

02:07:21.22
redwhitepodcast
What I would what I did say when we talked about something similar in the chat other day was if Chuck a motto had was Russell Wilson right that was that overlap there if Russ had played Chuck Mao basically had a quarterback and could keep a staff together. He'd still be our coach.

02:08:05.84
Will
Um, yeah I you I mean I've I've heard.

02:08:26.60
redwhitepodcast
It's kind of a kind of weird take cause they he would been here like 20 years at this point but he was recruiting well he's perfectly set up for the n I I think he would have he would have loved that I think his you know shortcomings obviously were you know building that staff and. Finding a quarterback not named Harrison back.

02:08:49.94
Will
Yeah I think the thing with Chuck is I mean if you've just heard him talk recently like there's no way he'd still be coaching right now and I hate to say it right? but his career post NCState wasn't that glorious or glamorous. So.

02:09:16.22
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

02:09:22.34
Will
I think he was kind of hidden in his ceiling with us anyways. But I think in this era if the NILEra was when he was coaching I think he definitely would have gotten probably 3 or four more years like he would would you they would just made it work.

02:09:36.22
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

02:10:07.94
redwhitepodcast
Pull up his so pull up his coaching record and my None thought was Chuck gets fired but Kevin Keats still has a job that was this joke.

02:09:58.96
Will
Um.

02:10:40.20
redwhitepodcast
But in conference play Chuck was 4 and 4 4 and 4 5 and 3 4 and 4 3 and 5 3 and 5 and then 2 and 6 8 year got fired sounds Betterton Keats he's 500 yeah but but postseason he he won the.

02:10:37.42
Will
Sounds like Kevin Keats I mean that's that's the I mean that's the I mean yeah I mean like like there was I eat everyone kind of like yeah the micron p soup. Yeah, here's the thing I remember writing it.

02:11:15.38
redwhitepodcast
Pc bowl he won the gatorator bowl won Tangerine Bowl he he 4 1 ball games ga but Keats got one post user win. Go ahead. Sorry.

02:11:17.40
Will
Like key I would just say like a motto for all we like about him like those teams were super undisciplined like there were so many penalties so many unnecessary penalties and I remember I wrote something for the um God of I'm blanking on the name because it's like not even a real student newspaper anymore.

02:11:37.38
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, oh yeah.

02:11:56.90
Will
Um, what is our school newspaper. The technician. Thank you I remember I wrote an article because Fsu was coming to town and I was just like oh man the the key to this game is who's gonna have the most penalties and I like went back just wrote it all out and I was just like just watch if you know.

02:12:16.00
redwhitepodcast
Technician.

02:12:32.12
redwhitepodcast
Yeah I remember that.

02:12:34.48
Will
And I said this is the other thing you should watch if Fsu has more penalties Nc state going into halftime I guarantee you that Tommy Bouton or not. But or Bobby Bowon is gonna rip whatever the official is going into halftime and you're gonna see a completely different use of flags in the second half and sure enough it happened exactly like that. So um, yeah I mean Chuck man what what? a great guy. Um, oh wow you know I didn't realize he was that ah acrid for None ars but.

02:13:36.60
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

02:13:40.50
Will
To answer the question. The only other coach I could think of that's a head coach or was a head coach that would come here is Chris Ash because yeah, because he's the db coach for the raiders right now and he was the safeties coach for the Jaguars. So.

02:14:06.62
redwhitepodcast
That's good. That's a good one Tony Gibson takes a job somewhere Chris Ash and Dave get back together can see that.

02:14:28.26
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

02:14:19.12
Will
If he wanted to come back. But I feel like once those guys get up there. They don't want to come back? um.

02:14:37.56
redwhitepodcast
And not many of them do all right now that Dave has been here for almost decade what is identity of a dave dorm program now. What do you think he wants it. What do you think he wants it to be. That's a yeah.

02:14:47.88
Will
Hard tough together hands in the dirt b blue collar you know like it is it is a hundred percent a Dave Doran program um for sure. There's the only thing I think you wanted to be is acc champion hands in the dirt.

02:15:31.80
redwhitepodcast
Yeah, hands in that chambership dart. Yeah, what position position group as a unit improves the most this year we all want to be the office of line but which one actually does.

02:15:23.30
Will
Like.

02:15:41.22
Will
Actually as funny as like I was gonna say it was offensive line because I think they have the most room like just by pure delta to get to right? Um, let's see the wide receivers could improve.

02:16:06.52
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

02:16:16.94
Will
I mean I really I mean I'm I'm really banking on Anthony Smith a lot here but just from an explosiveness. Um the difference of line you know, frankly like if C J Clark is healthy and you can use Jordan how you want and savvy on and these guys continue to come along. I think that group could be a lot better. It may not pop statistically but there were a bunch of games last year where I was kind of like man. It seems like these guys are just like stuck in up in mud at times. Um, so I would say running backs.

02:17:36.39
redwhitepodcast
I'm going running backs help I think Jordan Houston is gonna make the most of his opportunity and I'm I'm concerned about the depth behind him. But I think Jordan Houston is gonna be more dynamic than.

02:17:57.62
Will
Yeah I'm of opinion like a running backs are running backs are running back at this point. Um I think we will at least tread water I'm I'm still worried about past protection. So I don't know who who's gonna be our guy on None downs. That's gonna have to be in the game.

02:18:10.96
redwhitepodcast
Bam and Ricky.

02:18:35.52
Will
But everyone talks about demisumo so you know that's that kind of bam night x factor potentially so I could see them at least treadwater I mean if the oline improves it'll make it easier for a lesser running back group to still make it work. And you know, um I got a feeling you know Jordan Houston's gonna have that eye of the tiger. You know, kind of thing going for him. He's hungry. He wants to prove himself. Um, and if we're passing a ton. He's gonna get leveraged a lot in the passing game and I think him in the open field was. Probably is probably more dynamic in the passing game than Ricky or bam were if that makes sense.

02:20:19.66
redwhitepodcast
Yep I agree who replaces vi Jones He was a very ver style player who who fills in.

02:20:20.28
Will
Um, my God I got look up the freaking rosford again. Um, it's gonna be who is the young putt and what was it parker that Ah yeah.

02:20:59.90
redwhitepodcast
Parker Jalen Scott were the ones that got the most pt and then.

02:20:56.12
Will
I mean it's gonna be None of those guys are any of them the athlete that he is I don't know like that seems like a Jordan pool type thing but I don't he doesn't mean Levi Jones was like just the right kind of body type. He was long. He was lean. Um, that's a good question. It's probably gonna be parker or someone like that you know like they were talking a lot about ka and I'm sorry.

02:21:54.30
redwhitepodcast
I wouldn't be surprised to Caden Ford Nos because I would be surprised to see them use Peyton Wilson in the more standup role if they go for backers and put. You know Drake Isaiah Moore and Jaylen Scott probably I could see that being the case and then using Peyton who is very similar body type to vi jones and you know athletically probably a little bit better than vo jones was.

02:22:43.12
Will
Well I was gonna say you don't need to buy jones if you have a healthy Peyton Wilson um except you just haven't been able to say that for the last two years unfortunately so like that's what I was kind of saying earlier. It's like if this is a year where the defense stays healthy and leary stays healthy like.

02:23:02.58
redwhitepodcast
May exactly? yeah.

02:23:19.56
Will
I think it is lights out at that point then you're talking like we should be at worst 11 at one because there's no one else with a defense like this except for Clemson maybe and they've got a lot of question marks because of their turnover. So that's a tough question though. It's Peyton.

02:23:59.16
redwhitepodcast
Is tough question.

02:23:55.70
Will
Maybe the other guys are gonna be so good that Peyton just comes off the bench because we're like hey we gotta keep em on a snap count.

02:24:14.78
redwhitepodcast
That would be that would be insanity. The other thing I wanted to talk about real quick. We're getting long was the well baseball is doing good that was not it scrolling through my Twitter feed or retweet something the other day. Oh yeah, it was the Jibo Fisher thing so Joeovus and Joe Jilio put out this again. Surprise storyline that is an old story that we've talked about a long time.

02:24:55.86
Will
And.

02:25:26.10
redwhitepodcast
Jimbo Fisher and will mustchamp could have been a package deal back when we hired Tom O'brien and basically my point what I said was it was old news. It's not something that is.

02:25:59.20
redwhitepodcast
Shocking right? It shouldn't be shocking everybody. Some people might have not heard a story but it's still one of Fowler's yeah technically Fowler's screw up but Jimbo is begging for this job and Fowler Wanted A proven head coach.

02:26:17.30
Will
1 idiot.

02:26:33.60
redwhitepodcast
And you know he um, ended up hiring a proven head coach that didn't like recruiting I think there's you know my point was it's not I said it's not some grand curse. It's just you know 40 years of horrible leadership somebody clarified to me though that and I know this person is accurate cause we were having this conversation to the time The only thing that we'll add here. This is ius his tweet is that Fowler was actually set on sidelines by the money during this search due to his ineptitude during the basketball search at that time the money thought Tom O'brien was the obvious safe safe hire. Additionally Dr Jerry Punch was Jimbo's big cheerleader and advocate.

02:27:27.92
Will
And.

02:27:52.66
redwhitepodcast
And Ny state side like he was so Dr Jerry punch the state alumni was pushing Jimbo for that job and we still again leadership got put to the side and our good old boys. Let that one slip through like Tom O'brien was the answer there again. We just can't get out of our own way I thought it was interesting. You know I don't know why these guys dug it up other than those 2 were talking about saving and Jimbo fighting. But.

02:28:30.68
Will
Yeah.

02:28:51.70
Will
Yeah, it was really weird because I mean though well 2 thoughts I'm curious what Tom O'brien's tenure would have ended like at if he just stayed in boston college because I think I think he was set up to succeed there right? He had what he needed which was an offensive line.

02:29:09.30
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

02:29:34.84
redwhitepodcast
Um, yeah.

02:29:31.00
Will
And they could get quarterbacks and you know his worst mistake was thinking my formula up here will easily translate down there and then he didn't realize what he was waiting into when he got down here and then he didn't want to participate in it at all and it all works out when you have Russell Wilson

02:29:58.92
redwhitepodcast
Yeah.

02:30:07.16
Will
Starts falling apart when you have Mike Lenn and then when you have what pete whatever his name is like see him man. Yeah yeah, Pete Thomas like you Ryan was on the wall then but the other thing is like the the only other hearsay at the time was jembo and.

02:30:28.96
redwhitepodcast
Thomas. Yeah.

02:30:41.44
Will
But polai supposedly were a package deal but I don't know you just wish it's funny like I mean Yao took more swings when during her tenure. Um, you know it've been interesting to see what if you had it if you had someone like ya back then. Where we would have landed she she probably would have seen she probably would have seen it better. Um there.

02:31:41.14
redwhitepodcast
Well, her thing is always she wanted a recruit her right? she wanted somebody that could get talent and that was Jimbo's you know Jimbo's a salesman that's what he can do is what I always done. It makes you wonder? yeah.

02:31:42.24
Will
Yeah, could I had jamus good ahead Russell Wilson then you could have jam boy game over.

02:32:23.80
redwhitepodcast
It's funny to think about how different things could have been had you know the one we not been. It's stupid but just things had lined up better for us right? And then again going bringing is back to the None conversation about and Ni is like. I have trust issues with wolf pack athletics right? If you want my money you want me to participate I need to be justified where what who's leading this effort and where is this stuff going because there's been a long history of us shooting ourselves in the Foot. So. Yeah, yeah, again, Yeah ah, Baseball's doing baseball things. This team is you never know what you're gonna get like they can be good.

02:33:27.36
Will
I Think a lot of us feel their way.

02:34:12.80
redwhitepodcast
And when they're when they're good when they're playing Well they're good when they're when they're not on. They're frustrating as hell as somebody in the chat had a good tweet this this program is never boring sometimes good sometimes confusing sometimes Covid but never boring was like that's pretty much spot on. Yeah.

02:34:37.26
Will
Dude Could you imagine after this season though if somehow they win this weekend and win the tournament like there are their Acc champions then right.

02:35:01.46
redwhitepodcast
They have a really good chance. They have a really good chance of being ac champions it. It feels like the year that was a duke it was de duke be us maybe or that it was that year

02:35:12.50
Will
Duke last year

02:35:34.36
redwhitepodcast
I don't remember when it was it last night last year was like I mean it's what it was right? and then Duke got bounced early in the tournament and you're like we feel like that the other side of that team like a team that's good enough to win the ac tournament probably not good enough I don't think pitching's good enough to.

02:35:22.26
Will
Yeah, last year we won lost like None right we couldn't get a freaking bat going that game. Yeah.

02:36:13.56
redwhitepodcast
Roll through to oma. But I'm in man I've been I've watched pretty much every game My boys have sat there and watched it with me and I I enjoy it I'm I'm back into join baseball again which has been a long time Since. My Yankee fanhood. But anyway, thanks for joining us I don't think anything else.

02:36:50.54
Will
Now I'm just what I just saw that the the canes are up 3 1 right now with ah probably about less than 3 minutes left also go see top gun Maverick this weekend. It's like a 97% at ro tomatoes and according to 1 of our own. It's effing amazing.

02:37:36.18
redwhitepodcast
Oh what about the sccb in Russia and the alliances nato what's going on with that.

02:37:32.80
Will
You know I'm just gonna have to save it because I you know we'll have to save it for when talk about the schedules. Hopefully you know Acc was all chatter chatter about 3 None schedule and then now that they have the opportunity to implement it. It's been crookets. But yeah I'm gonna save my great lines for next week

02:37:54.76
redwhitepodcast
Ah I got on note.

02:38:17.94
redwhitepodcast
Okay, well I'm gonna take a screenshot. So don't forget it.

02:38:12.60
Will
Yeah, please do.

02:38:30.78
redwhitepodcast
And then don't Toma Hawk Chop was the other one ah look at ah all right folks as always thanks for listening and thanks for being patient with the lack of content during this last couple weeks but we are back.

02:38:23.98
Will
Yeah, no, no, no, don't hey hey I'm saving that one that's.

02:39:10.66
redwhitepodcast
And yeah, we'll have more trying some new things so be on lookout for that. But as always thanks for listening. Go pack.

02:39:13.18
Will
Go pack.